Some Key Points Regarding Project Dark

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With all the information pertaining to Project Dark that is leaking, lingering questions remain. We are still days away from the official T-Mobile announcement, but one of our great readers was kind enough to ensure some key points still come across. If more questions are out there, pass them along and I’ll see what I can do about getting them answered.

-Even More:
Contract
Discounted Handset Upfront

Even More Plus:
No Contract
Lowest Rates
No discount on handset
Retail Price of phone may be paid in 20 installments

-With the Even More Plus (no contract) there is no subsidized price on the phone, but customers will be offered to purchase the phone at retail price and pay for it in 20 installments, and yes, Equipment credit lines will be very high and reasonable for Even More Plus customers.

-After October 25th when these plans launch, all existing plans will become grandfathered are no longer available. Yes, MyFaves is gone. All customers with the grandfathered contracted plans will be able to switch to an Even More plan (contract) without an extension of their existing contract or an extra fee.

-The times where an extra fee is incurred include:
Switching from Even More to Even More plus will require paying a $200 termination fee, so us reps have been told repeatedly to make sure we help customers pick the right plan for them before activating.
Switching from a grandfathered plan to Even More Plus will require a $35 fee per line. On Family plans there is no fee for lines 3-5, so the most you’d have to pay is $70. Once on the Even More Plus, you must still carry out the rest of your contract, but you will never be able to switch to Even More and will never again get a subsidized price on a phone. The reason why someone might want to do this in the first place is because the Even More Plus plans are going to be slightly cheaper than Even More.

-There is no way to switch from Even More Plus to Even More without canceling all together and getting a new phone number

-To re-emphasize: Customers with existing plans will be grandfathered, yet with such low price offerings, will you want to keep them?

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  • RC

    I would consider switching to Even More Plus, since I buy my phones unlocked anyway. I would hope to keep my Total Internet add-on, since the TOS on that plan is much better than today’s “unlimited” plans…

  • watbetch

    I find it interesting that they offer no-contract phone subsidization (basically financing it). This of course would need to be subject to a credit check right?

  • Michael Houghton

    I’ll pay the fee. Count me in.

  • D

    I don’t see why they would not allow people to switch from Even More Plus to Even More. Is there just something about it that I’m not getting? So if you switch to Even More Plus, then lets say two years later you want to switch to Even More (and sign a contract) to get a new phone at a discount, is this not possible? Can someone explain?

  • Felicia

    So if you renew a contract after Oct 25, you won’t have myFaves?

  • dan

    I work at sams club for radioshack and we just droped tmobile for verzion I bet my company wish they would have waited cause we haven’t sold one verzion phone since we switched at my location its been 2 weeks lol we sold 15 to 20 tmobile a week, awesome choice lol

  • lava

    My current plan is a family MyFaves 600 plan with both lines having unl. text & data for $99 a month. Do you think these Even More plans will beat that?

  • ali

    The ‘even more plus’ option of financing the phone is unnecessary. If you want a cheap handset, contract. If you want no contract, use your credit card or pay cash. Why does t-mobile think that the installment plan is going to work ? They are going to be left with millions lost on phones that will not be paid for and adding to the already large collection agency headaches that plague all large businesses. And based on whats already been circulated, these new plans are all hype anyways.

  • Matthew

    I don’t understand. I can see why they wouldn’t ;et people switch from Even More to Even More Plus without having to pay a terminatino fee, but why should the reverse not be possible? I would think someone going from no contract to a 2 year contract would be more of a goal. And I am curious about the new plans as well, what is going to happen to myFaves? I currently have The Loyalty Unlimted plan with the $35 Data plan, is there going to be something better for me to switch to?

  • Matthew

    And whatever happened to T-Mobile buying Sprint or having some kind of roaming agreement with MetroPCS and all that news about Clearwire (whatever they are call), and them switching from WiMAX to LTE?

  • http://www.russellheimlich.com/blog Russell Heimlich

    So this is project black that is supposed to propel T-Mobile to 3rd place? Sounds underwhelming. There’s got to be something we don’t know that really drives the deal home. Come on unannounced uber-Android phone.

  • Alex

    So, if you were about to enter another new contract, you should wait a few days ?

    I was going to get a new phone because the sidekick issues, but would you just suggest waiting ?

    They told me that data plans are an additional 35$ a month now, and I only pay 20$ now, will it be cheaper with this plan or am I just dreaming ?

  • Matthew

    I agree with all… I haven’t seen anything substantial about these plans. Nothing mentioned about a reduced unlimited plan! I really don’t see what the big deal is as of yet anyway. Maybe I am missing something, but an installment plan doesn’t seem like a homerun hit to me. All (as far as plans are concerned) that is needed is a really nifty unlimited plan, coupled with a family plan that makes sense and will attract costomers from MetroPCS and other cheaper wireless companies.

  • Mark

    I must be missing something. These plans don’t look like a big change. The idea of paying full retail for a phone without contract is already a option. My main concern will be the retail price? They can always just raise the retail to whatever they want to force people onto the contract pricing. I guess I will wait for the complete package.

  • Matthew

    Lets hope it isnt a dream Alex! But I havent seen anything to support anything cheaper.

  • Matthew

    Yeah, I would say our speculation is still a bit premature. We need to wait for more concrete information…

  • watbetch

    Of course there will be unlimited plans for cheaper, DUH people.

  • Matthew

    I did see something about an unlimited plan for $50 that had talk and text, but didnt include data, so that wouldnt help me becasue I would still have to get a seperate data plan… But I suppose $50 talk/text plus $25 data beats $50 talk plus $35 date/text…

    And I know this is a bit off topic but does anyone know anything about when/if T-Mobile is going to have their upgrade to WM 6.5 availible for the Touch Pro2?

  • the observer

    Can tmobile make this anymore confusing. Guess even more plan is more suited for me then. Sucks how u cant switch between the plans without any hassle

  • rubi76

    The big deal is the Plus plan:

    -cheaper rates than regular plan
    -no contract
    -ability to subsidize the phone

    The third one is key because smartphones will be sold at even $ 500 (scary number to be paid upfront) – so instead of paying $ 200 right away for it and sign up for 2 years- you can pay over time.
    If you do the math for a smartphone sold at 500 you would pay $ 21 over 24 months, as opposed to 200 on the spot and a higher plan rate. $ 500 – 200 = 300 you would be paying over 2 years, or $ 12.5 per month. This means if the monthly difference between the two plans (per line) is over 12.5 you might as well go with the PLUS plan, as you would have lower costs per month. Also, you wouldn’t have a contract.
    Am I doing this right?

  • rossi

    umm, you pay full retail in exchange for cheaper monthly service rates… DO the math to figure out if you save money or not. You’ll be able to see the subsidized price of whatever device your looking at and see if it justifies paying the more expensive monthly rates.

    And no one knows prices now anyway, so I don’t know why people are writing this off already.

  • Matthew

    I agree with the observer.
    Okay, this should be my final statement, I know I have been saying a lot.
    But I think the unlimited plan should be $50 all inclusive; and thats talk, text and data! Now thats a game changer!

  • paul

    I now pay $ 162 a month on a family plan with 5 lines, are you saying that under this new plan I would only pay $ 70 a month? That’s huge..does that include unlimited everything? If not does anyone know what the cost a month that would be for all 5 lines with unlimited everything plan? It sounds like I’m going to save some serious coin.

  • Anthony

    The new plans is a good move for T-Mobile, but in order to really get ahead they need to be up to par with the other major wireless carriers. AT&T I hear has bad customer service, more expensive than T-Mobile, yet offers a wide array of better, high quality handsets. T-Mobile is cheaper, excellent customer service, yet poor choice of phones. I preordered the Motorola Cliq today because the other handsets offered just don’t do it for me. I am coming from an unlocked iPhone so I hope I am making a good move here… If, and when the N900 comes out… that will be my next choice depending on price and such. Of course, I extended my 2 year contract for the best pricing so now I have to pay retail on all handsets that are coming up! Grrrr haha

  • Matthew

    I think you have it wrong Paul. I am not exactly sure about the pricing, but I dont think that is what it will be.

  • rubi76

    If you guys could please stop asking questions about if it would be worth to switch or not… we dont have the
    definite answer cuz we dont have prices off!
    One thing for sure, if they are taking even my faves off its because the unlimited plan would be cheaper than any of the current my faves…
    So stop bashing this move until we actually see the pricing structure!
    I bet no one will stay on their grandfathered plans because there will be no reason to stay! Have faith in tmo !

  • paul

    I figured that I was off base(wishful thinking)this is the problem with piece meal info, you really can’t get a good handle on how it will affect you. I’m a T-Mobile guy,I like the phones, I like the service, so I’m in it for the long haul. If I can save some coin, upgrade my phone(HD2 Android,,some day) I’ll be happy…Hey I’m paying $ 162.00 a month now…so it’s going to be a win,win for me…

  • Pedro

    Ugh, if this is true then I’m gonna have to talk to someone, it’s so damn confusing!!!

  • Pat

    I’m with Paul–I can’t seem to get a handle on all the Project dark stuff, but I and my family like T-Mobile, like the customer service, and the phones.We’re in it for the duration. Used to be with VW and was treated very badly so found a home with T-mobile. I’m paying right now over 200 bucks for 2 smart phones, two not so smart phones and a home line. Whatever this is going to be I’m in it and we will save money. This will probably allow me to get a smarter phone(LOL). That’s my story and I’m stickin to it.

  • edd

    just want to say…even more and even more plus are very confusing names…

  • hi!

    Damn, this looks awful. Terrible…..frustrating.

    First, it’s beyond confusing. With Sprint you can call ANY mobile and get unlimited text/data for $70. That makes sense…people like that. This TMobile jibberish makes literally no sense and if they think it’s going to move them into third place it’s laughable.

    Second, Getting rid of myfaves will probably prove to be the worst idea in TMo history. It’s got them a ton of press and customers so now they’re doing away with it? What chimpazee runs this place? Like I’ve said from the start, if it’s not $50 for unlimited talk/text/data then this is a flop for the ages.

    Third, you can already buy phones for full retail price THIS SECOND. This isn’t new, this isn’t even news. How they’re trying to market this is beyond me. It’s an option now and has been for a while.

    Please TMobile, don’t force me out. iPhone’s are 99 bucks ($49 refurbished). I can have essentially unlimited everything on Sprint for $70 (not to mention use an awesome Hero or Pre at those prices). Freakin Verizon is getting the Droid which looks beyond awesome and will completely and totally steal all our Android Thunder. Offer me something…anything. I’m starting to think everyone on TMobile should get a $100 gift card and not just the people who lost Sidekick data, haha.

  • hi!

    Oh! I forgot to mention that if/when I “upgrade” to a new even more plus (confusing name!!!!) I’ll be charged $35. That is, of course, on top of the $35 I’ll probably have to pay to activate a new phone. So, these, “awesome” (god awful) new plans will cost me $70 on the spot just to “take advantage of”. Maybe it’s better if Sprint just buys us out now?

  • http://none Melvin

    will current customers be able to switch to these plans???

  • Touch pro2 user

    What about TV service???

  • timmyjoe42

    No more my faves? That’s weird. What if I want to add a line in the future.
    What about mobile to mobile?

  • artiepants

    while i think most of this is really great (i’d rather get a better rate and just buy the phone outright), these $35 “activation fees” seem like total bullcrap to me. i thought the $18 activation fee was pushing the boundaries of “something for nothing” on the carrier side, almost double that is a hard pill to swallow.

  • paul

    Who wants to get more depressed….Theres a Blog out there stating that Nokias N900 is NOT coming to T-Mobile after all…can you believe that..If this is true,,this project dark/black is indeed looking more and more dark..heres the link if you can handle it.www.tmotoday.com/blogs/william/10/19/2009/no-n900-t-mobile-heres-n97-mini-your-troubles

  • Jeff

    How do these changes affect family plans? I haven’t heard any mention of family plans in all the Project Dark talk. I hope they have something in line for low-usage customers. My parents use very few minutes so these ‘unlimited’ plans are very underwhelming for me.

  • Steven

    I think I understand what’s going on here. Instead of having people with 1000 minute plans or 600 minute plans, it’s all going to be two plans. Either you have Even More, which is unlimited minutes, texts, and data (optional on the last two) under contract, or you have the Even More Plus, which is like the flex-pay plans that people have now.

  • braveXheart

    are data plans still required for certain phones cliq, g1, my touch etc…? I want the Cliq so bad because of the sexy looking keyboard but the data plan is just way to much money a month.

  • Steven

    This will all be so much less confusing when prices for the plans come out.

  • deangelo724

    So will Even More Plus be available to FlexPay customers? I’m so confused!!

  • sprinter

    bummer about N900….TMO today give the handsets for christmas and it is lame!

    Has T Mobile ever even confirmed project dark, and if so have they said they will tell us all on Oct 25th? I wonder if we will even know then. For now it is sounding more gimmick then revolution, but that all will depend on the pricing. The problem is with all this hype, no matter what comes out we are going to be disappointed. We had it up to getting a new 4G iphone with unlimited everything for 50 bucks a month!! That was just silly…and now when we get the real news we will be disappointed.

  • FILA

    This is so stupid, so confusing, nice way to fuck up people T. This is not the way to get more sales. You want sales? 50 or $60 unlimited plan, thats cheaper then Sprint. $60 for unlimited everything, simple as that, then youd have ability to flex pay like you have now but the ability without having to have credits. We need wayyy more details to really see whats goin on. We have no idea whats goin on with myFavs, data, plan prices or anything. All confusing to me

  • http://www.i-appreciate.org alt-mobile

    I have been with T-Mobile since it was Voicestream…and this Project Dark/Black kind of sucks…

    And like other people have said, what’s up with the Family Plans? Is there a Family Plan and Extended Family Plan or something like that anywhere?

  • Steven

    @atl-mobile

    I imagine the family plans will have a Even More plan of their own. Or each line might be on an Even More Plan. Time will tell!

  • rubi76

    Alt-mobile and Jeff
    of course there are family plans, if you would just chill down and wait a couple of days you would get them. They are already mentioned though.
    Fila and Timmyjoe:
    I can see you are very optimistic as well. Guess what? you won’t need myfav anymore because the unlimited everything will be cheaper than what you are paying now for myfav.
    Sprint:
    If you were waiting for an Iphone 4g with a $50 unlimited plan and for anything else you would be disappointed, you should switch to another carrier (let me know which one, as no one will ever offer that)

    Please cheer up as the plans will be amazing!
    We need more details to know whats going on but you guys should cheer up and wait for the official news with a smile…

  • Bigg

    So from what I understand, if I have 4 fam plan right now, and I switch to even more plus, I have to pay 70 bucks in fees. Ok got that part, but now, how much is unlimited talk,text and web gonna cost?

  • rossi

    @rubi

    Some of these people need to chill out, and wait until the full release of information is made. At this time of course the plans are confusing because all of the information is not available, most importantly the pricing!

    So, People, Chill out, wait for the official release or a more complete leak… until then don’t hesitate to speculate. Really though, the crying is not necessary…. yet.

  • NiiDiddy

    Here are the issues I see with some of the up-coming changes:

    1) If the unlimited individual “even more” plan with unlimited talk/txt/data doesnt hover around the $50 – $60 range, T-Mobile fails to Sprint and retains 4th place.

    2) Likewise if the family 1500 talk plan with unlimited txt/data doesnt hover around $99 – $120 (2 phones) range, T-Mobile fails to Sprint and retains 4place.

    3) Again, if the unlimited family “even more” plan with unlimited talk/txt/data doesnt hover around the $150 – $170 range, T-Mobile fails to Sprint and retains 4th place.

    ** Also keep in mind Sprint’s plans include TV. I was looking at Sprints Any Mobile Anytime plans to compare…extraordinary!!!

    4) I am not interested in the “even more plus” plans because that COULD also be the down fall of T-Mobile…unless they know something we don’t know. As easy as it is for T-Mobile to put customers on a no contract plan with a cool phone with payments spread over 20-months…it’s with the same ease people with and “even more plus” plans may leave T-Mobile (since they have no contract) and not pay on the phone…thus creating a bad debt for the company and losses passed on to 2-yr subscribers. People break contracts without paying the fee…what makes T-Mobile think people wont walk away from a no contact plan with a basically “free” phone if they decide not to pay for it?!?!?!? T-Mobile must know something we don’t know here…hence the patience for Oct 25 to roll by.

    5) MyFaves…Stupid of them to do away with MyFaves! Nuff said…go figure!!! Stick with something that worked is my motto. It almost like telling GEICO to get rid of the gecko or its cavemen…

    I believe #1 through #3 will be met by Magenta. But I still await Oct 25. I hope they prove all of us wrong and come up with extraordinary plans/phones///etc.

    I love T-Mobile so much…I am in for the long haul…heck I have been here since back in the day. SO I AM HOPING FOR THE BEST!!! I only want the best for the company…I want to see them march systematically on up…